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Telegram Encryption Meets State Pressure
Security Post #6187, on Aug 24, 2024 in TG

Telegram Encryption Meets State Pressure

Why is this Security meme funny?

Level 1: The Locked Box

It is like two people putting notes in a locked box where only they have the keys, and then someone demands that the box maker secretly keep a spare key "only for emergencies." The funny, bleak part is that once the spare key exists, everyone has to worry about who can steal it, copy it, or redefine "emergency" tomorrow.

Level 2: What MITM Means

End-to-end encryption means only the people at the two ends of a conversation should be able to read the messages. The server can help deliver messages, but it should not have the keys needed to decrypt them. That is why the phrase Secret Chats matters: it refers to the more private chat mode, not every conversation on Telegram.

A man-in-the-middle attack happens when a third party secretly sits between two people who think they are talking directly. In messaging, that could mean tricking both sides into using keys the attacker can read. A "backdoor" is when a system intentionally includes some special way for an outside party to get access. The joke is that the caption treats a law-enforcement or moderation demand as if someone asked the developers to deliberately build the attack that encryption is supposed to prevent.

Level 3: Moderation Meets Cryptography

The meme lands because it compresses a messy legal and policy story into a developer-shaped panic button: "they arrested the messenger CEO because he would not add a backdoor." The August 24, 2024 timing matters here because reports that day described Durov being detained in France, while the stated investigative framing centered on moderation, cooperation with law enforcement, and alleged criminal misuse of the platform. The caption's MiTM backdoor explanation is a pointed interpretation, not something visible in the photo and not the whole reported legal theory at that moment.

That tension is exactly why security people argue about these cases so intensely. Governments and investigators see platforms as infrastructure used by criminals and ask for cooperation, retention, takedowns, identity data, or access. Privacy engineers see a recurring pattern where "cooperation" slowly becomes "make confidential systems readable to someone else." Trust-and-safety teams are left standing in the blast radius, because abuse is real, victims are real, and cryptographic guarantees are also real. Everyone arrives with a morally serious concern and a proposed architecture that quietly breaks someone else's world.

Telegram makes the debate even messier because it is not simply Signal with different branding. Its normal cloud chats prioritize multi-device sync and platform features, while Secret Chats are the privacy-focused end-to-end encrypted mode. The meme chooses the strongest version of the privacy argument by focusing on Secret Chats: if those conversations are supposed to be unreadable by Telegram, then adding invisible inspection would not be moderation policy; it would be product sabotage with a badge.

Level 4: Backdoor By Another Name

The image itself is a plain conference photo of Pavel Durov wearing a headset microphone, but the post caption supplies the technical charge: not adding any kind of MiTM backdoor for secret chats. That phrase is doing a lot of work. In a genuine end-to-end encrypted chat, message plaintext exists at the endpoints, while the server only routes ciphertext. A man-in-the-middle design would insert some additional party into the key exchange or message flow so that someone other than the sender and recipient can decrypt or inspect the communication.

For Secret Chats specifically, Telegram describes them as device-specific end-to-end encrypted conversations, separate from its cloud chat model. That distinction matters because Telegram is often discussed as if "Telegram encryption" were one uniform thing. It is not. Cloud chats use a server-mediated model designed for synchronization across devices; Secret Chats are the part where the backdoor argument becomes cryptographically sharp. If the service truly lacks the keys, the demand "just decrypt it" is not an API request. It is a request to redesign the trust model.

Technically, a lawful-access backdoor can be dressed up as key escrow, client scanning, silent participant injection, special recovery keys, or modified clients, but all versions have the same rotten invariant: someone has to be trusted with an exceptional capability. Once that capability exists, the system must defend it against insiders, attackers, hostile states, compromised update channels, and legal demands from jurisdictions that do not agree with each other. The math does not care that the product manager called it "targeted access."

Description

The image is a conference-style photograph of Pavel Durov seated in a black jacket, wearing a headset microphone and looking to the side against a blurred stage background. There is no overlaid text in the image itself. The sibling post links the photo to an August 24, 2024 TF1-LCI report about the Telegram founder and CEO being detained in France, while the post caption frames the story as punishment for running Telegram without adding a man-in-the-middle backdoor for secret chats. The technical context is the long-running conflict between encrypted messaging, moderation demands, law-enforcement access, and whether platforms should weaken confidentiality for investigatory convenience.

Comments

51
Anonymous ★ Top Pick Apparently the threat model now includes landing your private jet in a jurisdiction with strong opinions about `decrypt()` being impossible.
  1. Anonymous ★ Top Pick

    Apparently the threat model now includes landing your private jet in a jurisdiction with strong opinions about `decrypt()` being impossible.

  2. @saniel42 1y

    People acting shocked when free speech doesn't only mean good things

    1. dev_meme 1y

      So fuck them Freedom of speech is more important than investigation of any crime This is one of key check-and-balances which separates citizens-oriented and nomenclature-oriented governments

      1. @saniel42 1y

        Agree Like what's next, gonna ban Signal too? This is idiotic, telegram isn't facilitating any crimes on purpose. If telegram didn't do it they would find a way. Especially since there are more and more decentralized open source chat apps popping up

  3. @GaggiX 1y

    cryptos and the fact that you can create an account without a telephone number has probably promoted CP and drug trafficking on the platform and authorities do not like that

    1. @Johnny_bit 1y

      It's the criminals and pedos doing that, not the platform...

      1. @GaggiX 1y

        the platform creates the perfect environment and probably Durov do not comply with subpoenas.

        1. dev_meme 1y

          So let’s stop any kind of secure communications? Let’s stop usage of TLS? Let’s arrest everyone linked to Signal/Threema/Proton/etc? Or maybe let’s pressure all OS vendors + github repo owners to enforce integration of gov root certificates and then jail everyone who dared to remove them? Where do you stop?

          1. @crookedman 1y

            Signal has CIA backdoors, so no, no need to arrest them.

            1. dev_meme 1y

              Yeah, and everyone were talking about @durov adding backdoors into telegram for years But here we are!

          2. @GaggiX 1y

            None of these services promote crypto shit that allows you to fund these activities anonymously.

            1. @Algoinde 1y

              Nothing prevents me from sending someone a bitcoin address in DMs on a private WoW server A platform literally doesn't fucking matter, the moment something is trusted and secure, everyone will use it. Talking face to face in an abandoned basement is also very secure and trustworthy, as well as handing cash over in a black bag, does everyone have to wear always-online microphones now and cash should be banned?

              1. @GaggiX 1y

                You're attacking a straw man, take your pills ahah no you should not be wearing a always-online microphone and cash should not be banned

                1. @Algoinde 1y

                  Just as a microphone and cash ban would be a violation of privacy and violation of freedom, so would banning a means of communication. Regulating? Maybe. But you can't regulate what you cannot decrypt, and it should stay that way, because if it's encrypted, it's private.

                  1. @GaggiX 1y

                    they are not banning Telegram and data on the Telegram servers is not encrypted as there is no end-to-end encryption on Telegram, except for secret chats.

                    1. @Algoinde 1y

                      >not encrypted https://security.stackexchange.com/questions/238562/how-does-telegrams-secret-splitting-scheme-work

                      1. @GaggiX 1y

                        "Telegram's claim that it is unable to do the same thing despite using exactly same database encryption technology, and having the key physically present in the server rack, is pure fabrication." literally the first answer

                        1. @Algoinde 1y

                          Doesn't matter, it's encrypted. With compromises for usability, but still encrypted. You said it's not.

                          1. @GaggiX 1y

                            It doesn't matter if they have the keys ahaha

                2. dev_meme 1y

                  You say it while both are being implemented as policies in different countries around the world

                  1. @GaggiX 1y

                    in which countries you have to wear an always-online microphone?

                    1. @callofvoid0 1y

                      NK

                      1. @GaggiX 1y

                        they barely have electricity in NK ahah

                    2. dev_meme 1y

                      What do you think phone with backdoor is? Oh, you don’t wear it? Let’s dig into your Bluetooth headphones

                    3. @noi01 1y

                      "always-online microphone" is literally just a smartphone bruh

      2. @vladyslav_google 1y

        But the platform allows them to do that without any risk of being exposed and punished, so...

        1. @Johnny_bit 1y

          Bullshit. It's just whining "oh noes, we cannot easily wiretap any conversation we want". GIT GUD scrub, do proper groundwork, catch criminal, don't hide behind "oh noes, he's using TeChNoLoGy and MaTh"

    2. @tokimonatakanimekat 1y

      Authorities conveniently use cp hysteria to push all kinds of restrictions and justify arrests like this one

  4. @Johnny_bit 1y

    That's The French for ye. One of the worst people on earth are french (Thierry Bretton)

    1. @realVitShadyTV 1y

      On of the worst people on earth was Jan Paweł II, the pedo protector.

  5. @Johnny_bit 1y

    To quote Franklin: those who would trade privacy for a bit security deserve neither privacy nor security.

  6. @Hollow_Arigo 1y

    Will guys from France go on protest about it? or they only interested in supporting palestine migrants and rgb-dye-hair eco guys with soup?

    1. @callofvoid0 1y

      no, they only protest for women and lgbtqrstuvwxyz rights

  7. @GaggiX 1y

    and I said and it's also reported in the first answer "End-to-end encryption exists to eliminate this problem entirely."

  8. @GaggiX 1y

    it's just obstruction of justice if you don't comply with subpoenas.

    1. @Algoinde 1y

      Well, what he does is certainly illegal in several jurisdictions, but is the correct thing to do. Don't let the government dictate what they can and cannot access, ensuring baseline privacy, then build on top of that to do report-based moderation. You can't moderate one-on-one chats and p2p chats, but you can moderate public content according to your ToS. Signal is literally doing the same when they receive FBI subpoenas. "Here's the data: timestamp of last connection data and account created timestamp; fuck you, we don't have any other data". Platforms do have responsibility for the public content they host, which is why there's things like DMCA, which protect the platform from legal action as long as the infringing public content is removed, and Telegram does have very effective channels to moderate this kind of content.

      1. @GaggiX 1y

        Signal has end-to-end encryption so they cannot comply even if they want to, that's the best thing about it

        1. dev_meme 1y

          So you read TG clients and know how secret chat work there right? Right?

          1. @sylfn 1y

            They don't work (in tdesktop)

            1. dev_meme 1y

              Not in official client but they are implemented in https://github.com/UnigramDev/Unigram https://github.com/vysheng/tg

        2. @sylfn 1y

          well unless they have a backdoor somewhere

          1. @GaggiX 1y

            unless there is a camera in the wall behind you

  9. @tokimonatakanimekat 1y

    And then political elites are no strangers to fucking kids at private islands, yet somehow nothing happens when they get caught doing it, only whistleblowers die and mountains of evidence disappear

  10. dev_meme 1y

    And that’s how e2ee p2p communications should work The only problem with TG’s secret chat’s is them being 1-1 chats

  11. @Algoinde 1y

    Eh, whatever it will be, I think the resolution will be favorable and there won't be any backdoors added. Just buy TON while it's on discount.

  12. @ercolebellucci 1y

    gov logic: people do trafficking w/ telegram platform why arrest criminals? let's block platform before internet no one was doing trafficking of any kind

    1. @TheUnstupidOne 1y

      Encryption is a wonderful thing It finally allowed people to have more or less private conversations across distances larger than a living room, and it pisses off authorities to unbelievable degree

  13. Алексей 1y

    Trash sons of whores

  14. Алексей 1y

    #Freedurov

  15. @plusdanshi69 1y

    fuck the baguettes

  16. @plusdanshi69 1y

    😆imagine getting arrested for things you didn't do 😂 That type of shit could happen only in putin's Russ.. oh wait

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